Sunday, April 27, 2008

Think it's only you?

Converts decline.

The number of people baptized in Southern Baptist churches in the United States fell for the third straight year in 2007 to the denomination's lowest level since 1987, and membership dipped as well.

The president of the Southern Baptist Convention blamed the decline in part on a perception that its followers are "mean-spirited, hurtful and angry."

The dropping number of followers in the United States' largest Protestant denomination reflects a trend in other mainline Protestant churches, while non-denominational churches are gaining and the ranks of the unaffiliated are growing.

But for a denomination that places winning converts at the heart of its mission, the continued slide is troubling and disappointing, said the Rev. Frank Page, the convention's president.

Part of the blame can be placed on a notion that Baptists have been known too much in recent years for "what we're against" than "what we're for," Page said.

"Our culture is increasingly antagonistic and sometimes adverse to a conversation about a faith in Christ," he said. "Sometimes that's our fault because we have not always presented a winsome Christian life that would engender trust and a desire on the part of many people to engage in a conversation on the Gospel.

David Key, director of Baptist studies at Emory University's Candler School of Theology, attributes the declining numbers to Baptist parents having fewer children than in years past. He also believes Baptist leaders haven't been aggressive enough in attracting nonwhite members.

"It's not just about parents not having enough children, we also haven't adjusted our youth programs to target multicultural youth," he said. "It's still a very white Southern experience as opposed to incorporating African-Americans, Hispanics and Asians."


http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/04/25/america/NA-GEN-US-Baptists-Decline.php

  “For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or greedy person
—such a man is an idolater—has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.”
Ephesians 5:5 (NIV)

The ideal of a believers’ church consistently appears in Baptist confessions of faith. Baptist theologians, pastors and other leaders through the centuries have held up no other model than that of a born-again church fellowship. That’s the ideal. But is this the reality?

Is There Evidence of a Decline in Regenerate Church Membership?

The distinguished Baptist historian William R. Estep stated, “Baptists in the United States are perilously close to losing their insistence upon a regenerate church membership.”

Other observers of Baptist life agree with Estep and cite as evidence for this conclusion such factors as the huge number of non-resident Baptist church members and the characteristics of many resident members with their lack of involvement in church life, a low level of financial support, little commitment to evangelism, missions and ministry, and a life style obviously contrary to the teachings of Jesus.

Of course, some of these factors may be the result of conditions other than an unregenerate condition, such as being “backslidden” or perhaps immature as a Christian (1 Corinthians 3:1-3; Ephesians 4:11-16). And certainly, numerous church members are wonderfully dedicated followers of Christ. Yet it would seem that these factors would not exist in such abundance if members of churches were truly born again.  Achieving a truly born-again church is a formidable challenge. Nevertheless, some things can be done, making prayer a primary ingredient in all that is done.

A church should emphasize the importance of a born-again church membership, stressing that a salvation experience ought always to precede church membership. Each person should assume responsibility for evaluating his or her spiritual condition, answering questions such as, “Have I truly experienced salvation by faith in Christ?” and “Am I growing as a Christian?” Persons should be urged to seek spiritual council if the answers are “no.”http://www.baptistdistinctives.org/textonly10.html

A counterpoint:

The cover of the November issue of US News & World Report announces an article about the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, popularly known as the Mormons. One of the article’s main points is the remarkable growth of the Utah-based religion, and the interesting observation that the emergence of Mormonism represents the first world-wide invention of a new religion since the prophet Mohamed gave the world Islam. Among the article’s more remarkable statements is a prediction about the growth in Church membership. It says: "If current trends hold, experts say Latter-day Saints could number 265 million worldwide by 2080, second only to Roman Catholics among Christian bodies. Mormonism, says Rodney Stark, professor of sociology and religion at the University of Washington, "stands on the threshold of becoming the first major faith to appear on Earth since the prophet Mohammed rode out of the desert."

This is a truly remarkable prediction. To put it in perspective, it says that worldwide Church membership, at about 11 million members today (2000), will grow to almost the population of the United States within a lifetime.
http://tinyurl.com/3qrvwp



test line breaks

26 comments:

Charles Cirilo said...

What a deal.

Aaron Cirilo said...

i heard about this...

Lotus Dale said...

lol

Lotus Dale said...

i guess maybe these other mainliners are also mean-spirited? they must be getting the wrong spirit, as opposed the the right Spirit ... cause the spirit is not s'posed to be mean-spirited, is it?

Lotus Dale said...

should i comment?

Lotus Dale said...

i'm with cac on this one. what a deal.

Aaron Cirilo said...

i think the church should let the Spirit do the teaching..

1 cor 2:14 the natural man can not receive the things of the spirit because they are spiritually discerned

If the Church focused on preaching the new birth experience then the Holy Spirit would lead and direct the lives. That way the world wouldn't see our "standards" of living as what we are known by and resent us.

Byron @ said...

That is what caught my eye too. It seems the southern baptists are more strict than mainstream baptists. But the declining numbers aren't limited to the baptists. The Lutherans, Methodists, everybody has seem a significant drop in new converts. The Newsweek article was based on Mormon enrollment and some fancy math predictions and was proven to be highly improbable/impossible. The link to the article was taken down, that was a cached version.
Born again has a similar but different meaning to each denomination, but they do mean a change of life.

Lotus Dale said...

You think "the world" resents your church bec of your "standards"?

Do you think "the world" resents your church (whether or not bec of your standards)?

Aaron Cirilo said...

i'm not sure if it's "resent" but i think it's the first thing that fills some peoples mind whenen they think of pentecostal is standards. of that i think we did something wrong.

I probably could have chose a better word. we someone have outward differences they have to be very humble & purposeful in conveying a message of deeper change.

I think that as a whole the world looks favorable to pentecostalism but in lots of communities we are resented. I think it's because we have forgotten the "old paths" of the great commission... simpling sharing the bread.

Lotus Dale said...

i think if pentecostals are resented, and i'm not sure i'd agree with that at all, it would not be bec of the "standards" ...

pentecostals "wear" their "standards" and it serves to separate themselves from the larger society in which they live, in terms of recognition as a separate group, just as the amish are recognized by their distinctive clothing.

if pentecostals garner resentment, it would be from their history of teaching/preaching themselves as the only ones on gods green earth to have the truth and everyone else is destined for hellfire and brimstone. i don't think that message endears pentecostals to too many groups; i.e., "the world". :)

i don't think anyone really cares abt pentecostal "standards" anymore than they care abt the amish who also live a very distinctive life in addition to dressing very distinctively all based on their religion.

Lotus Dale said...

(replying to myself again - haha)

- unless of course the impression is given/rec'd that the REASON the pentecostals think they are the only ones gonna make it is BECAUSE they wear their "standards." ~~ then it's unlikely that resentment is what is garnered so much as the thought that "those people REALLY can't believe that, can they?"

Byron @ said...

Now I just posted an article that the Baptists were the ones preaching this.

Byron @ said...

The LDS ranch looks suspiciously like Pentecostals in their manner of dress and I think the perceived association does not help in the real world.

Lotus Dale said...

yes. apparently each denomination has its own version of (sanctimonious) truth. *grin*

Lotus Dale said...

heh. i thought i was the only one who had noticed this.

speaking of .... when mamabird and i were inventorying a cemetery in south mississippi, some ol' lds geezer tried to flirt mama up several days in a row. he was on a tractor out there mowing and he just HAD to mow wherever she was working for the day. followed her all over. made her SOOOOO mad! she sd he was trying to get her AND her dau in one fell swoop added to his wives. lol.

Aaron Cirilo said...

the doctine of absolute truth will never endear us to those who see a different position..but that not something we can rid ourselves of.. it's our view of the Bible..right or wrong.. but our approach in non essential dress codes if done with elitism will cause bad PR.

Jesus said that we would be hated for His name sake.. he said that He is the door..that all must come thru Him.. it's very specific and we are not special because we believe that...we are sinners that are saved thru Him ..but He is special..thats why we want to remove any distractions from others seeing Him.

Lotus Dale said...

as i mentioned, everybody has their own version of "absolute truth" ... it isn't any more attractive coming fm southern baptists or any other fundamentalist group. i do think it is this "elitism" (if anything) rather than "standards"; i.e., dress codes, that garners "resentment" from those who are not members of yr group.

this part of the country is chock full of people with similar dress codes, most of them pentecostal, but others as well. byron mentioned the lds. the nazarenes also share the same dress code. anyway, i don't see where it bothers anyone how these groups dress. they attend school here like everybody else and no one seems to care how anyone dresses (unless they are following that fad of wearing their britches around their knees so their plumber's crack shows). they work in the public and no one seems to care. i don't know of anyone personally who cares one way or the other abt the dress codes. i could be wrong, but if pentecostals are resented, as you suggest, then i don't see it stemming from a dress code.

otoh, i have known some who thought one inch up or down, whether it was high heels, dress or sleeve lengths, made them "holier than thou" ... which seems more likely to garner ridicule than resentment.

but what do i know? just my thoughts.

Aaron Cirilo said...

i think all views have to be believed to be truth or else why believe it.. or
why convert "unbelievers"?

even the folk that believe in many truths ...believe that "many truths" is the only truth..

Lotus Dale said...

some groups do not proselytize. some groups even find it intrusive.

Aaron Cirilo said...

true... so boring ;)

Lotus Dale said...

condecension. :) jk

Aaron Cirilo said...

lol...

Charles Cirilo said...

I have known of people resenting folks because of their ultra-conservative dress codes.

Lotus Dale said...

i have known of lotsa people resenting others bec they got it all hanging out, especially if they got something to hang out; e.g., pamela anderson. *grin*

Aaron Cirilo said...

lol...